Once Saved Always Saved (1 of 3)

ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED

BY ADOLFO RICARDO YBARRA

(This work uses the King James Version and relies on the Textus Receptus Greek text)

(English is not the author’s native tongue, so there may be some non English expressions. It is available also the Spanish version of this text)

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INTRODUCTION

The purpose of this treatise is to make an exposition of the true gospel of salvation only by the faith in the precious sacrifice of Jesus and to expose the vicious nature of the Dan Corner’s false doctrine of The Believer's Conditional Security, which is also the title of a book of him; he have key parts of that book published in the web; so I have taken part of his chapter 5 from http://www.evangelicaloutreach.org/initial.htm September 2004 to make a point of launching of the exposition; I don’t cover all that chapter but only used it to begin the exposition to touch many foul things that Corner is teaching in his entire web site; I have not touched all his bad things, but the considerable amount of bad things here exposed are more than enough to destroy the structure of his error and to expose the unreliability of Dan Corner as a true interpreter of Scripture.

Suppose we have a structure of dominoes, a building resting on some few bases; suppose you retire one of those bases abruptly and the construction collapses at all; then the building is destroyed, the dominoes are spread. Well, the writings of Dan Corner will be our construction of dominoes, and we shall remove more than a single domino, we shall remove very many of his bad interpretations of passages; at the end, once that many false interpretation had been totally disapproved and exposed in his vicious nature, ALL HIS DOCTRINE COLLAPSES completely, the same as a construction of dominoes! In fact, his chapter 5 is about the concepts of initial salvation and final salvation, as Dan Corner understands them, it is a BASIC element of his construction, one of the keys of all his false doctrine of the believer's conditional security. Dan Corner, arrogantly and naively, boasts his book will never be refuted by saying "The Believer's Conditional Security will not be refuted!" I shall show many of the erroneous thing Dan has settled as his proofs and the error of his entire book will be recognized, so all his doctrine and book are demolished here by the Bible and are deprived of force and exposed as it is, a heap of rubble and of garbage, the garbage of a false gospel and a trap for the souls to make them to rest upon their proper works and not upon the Lord Jesus Christ and His finished work.

Let us clarify the following thing first, the Bible speaks of an initial salvation and of a final salvation, there are many initial salvation facts and many final salvation facts; in the Bible the concepts of initial salvation and final salvation exist. We are not refuting the existence of the initial salvation and the final salvation, we are refuting Dan Corner's false concepts on both. We are lifting the true biblical concepts against the Dan Corner's false concepts. And the result will be:

2 Corinthians 10:5

Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;

The Bible has plenty of passages talking about initial salvation and final salvation, and the same ones contradict what Dan Corner has to say.

Dan Corner is risking heavily the precious souls of the unsaved people, and misrepresenting the saved ones. I shall be attacking the false doctrine of conditional security of the believers, which is a trap for Dan and his victims.

OS (ONCE SAVED): INITIAL SALVATION

AS (ALWAYS SAVED): FINAL SALVATION INCLUDED

The first Dan’s presentation of his misguided concept of Initial Salvation:

Dan Corner begins his chapter 5 presenting his false concepts on initial and final salvation. First he presents what is for him the initial salvation. It is remarkable that, in his first presentation of initial salvation, the unbiblical aspects that he will introduce latter are out of view. Seems as in his words presenting initial salvation Dan Corner fear to mention the UNBIBLICAL hard things he have added later to his first presentation. But the hard unbiblical things concealed first by Dan Corner and presented in his whole writings can be revealed by the Bible and are shockingly heretical:

Because Dan Corner himself takes charge of to present in his book that his "initial salvation" "refers to the moment in time when a person extends a trusting-submitting faith in Jesus Christ for his personal salvation" but a faith which is not un-perishable, "and thereby instantly receives the gift of salvation" but an initial salvation which doesn’t secure final salvation. "At this same moment in time he also passes from spiritual death to life" but an eternal life which is neither secured for ever nor securer of final salvation, "from darkness to light and from the power of Satan to the power of God" but with the possibility that through temptation Satan may to push the Christian from the power of God so causing the Christian to be eternally damned. "Such a person is also set free from the slavery of sin" but not free from a future possibly damnation by the sins from which he is supposedly free. "As a recipient of eternal life", but an eternal life which is neither secured for ever nor securer of final salvation, "he has also been declared righteous in God's sight", but that declaration is neither definitive nor unchangeable, "and made a son of God", but whit the possibility of to be eternally damned equally, "because of his faith in Christ, who is now his Lord and Savior” but not the perfect Saviour we know.

That is the Dan Corner's initial salvation in all its full sad reality, as he sustains it in his whole writings.

The consequent Dan’s presentation of his misguided concept of Final Salvation:

Then, Dan Corner follows presenting his false concept of final salvation saying "Final salvation simply refers to entering the kingdom of God, which only occurs for those who die physically in a righteous state or are in such a spiritual state when the Lord returns." This false concept affirms there is not security of final salvation all the way in the life of a true believer in Christ, because the final salvation only is assured by the final state of the Christian at his dead or at the Lord's return. The key of this false concept is in the word "only" in "entering the kingdom of God, which only occurs for ... "; you can see it; Dan Corner says "entering the kingdom" ONLY occurs as a "final salvation". Is it true? Is it true the entering the kingdom ONLY occurs as a final salvation? Is Dan Corner saying a truth or is he erring making us to err and fail? What does the Bible say?

The true concepts of Initial and Final Salvation:

The Bible says:

Colossians 1:13

Who {the Father} hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son

Then Dan Corner is wrong. He said us that the entrance into the kingdom is ONLY the final salvation, while Paul the Apostle say us that God the Father hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son. Can you see it? Can you see how Dan is wrong? (For all who like to check the Greek text there are for "hath translated us" an Aorist Tense, Active Voice, Indicative Mood; then we have that "hath translated us" is an actual past fact in the life of the true believer, not a future one, not a conditioned one by a future fact, not an hypothetical one, etc., verily, verily an actual past fact in the life of the true believer) Paul the Apostle really say us that God the Father hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son.

Now it is opportune to enter the true biblical concept of Initial Salvation but only as it arises from the words of Paul the Apostle. Initial Salvation, according to Colossians 1:12-13, simply refers to entering into the kingdom of God, which occured really in a past time of the life of the true believer, the first time he has believed, or as Dan said “to the moment in time when a person extends a trusting-submitting faith in Jesus Christ for his personal salvation”; thus the language of the Apostle speaks as if we the true believers are now into the kingdom thus assuring us with his strong language we shall enter the final phase of the kingdom at last.

That is to say: THE FINAL SALVATION IS COMPLETELY SECURED BY THE PAST INITIAL SALVATION OF THE TRUE BELIEVER.

Dan Corner failed saying the initial salvation doesn’t secure the final salvation. Paul the Apostle has led us saying the initial salvation secures the final salvation. Whom will you believe? It is time to listen always the Apostle Paul.

Colossians 1:13

Who {the Father} hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son

Glory to God!!! Alleluia!!!

Then, after having erased the footprints of our present entrance into the kingdom, Dan follows saying the Christian now "is somewhere between his past conversion experience and his future entrance into the kingdom, that is, assuming he endures to the end " making us to err in speaking only of our future entrance into the kingdom and ignoring again the decisive statement of Paul upon our present translation into the kingdom:

Colossians 1:13

Who {the Father} hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son

“hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son” is declared a fact by Paul, that is, a past fact in the life of the believer and then not dependent on a future condition as that supposed by Dan Corner: "assuming he endures to the end". Conversely, because the Christian has been translated “into the kingdom of his dear Son”, his present faith is un-perishable, Dan speaks of a faith, which need to be maintained to endure to the end, the Word of God speaks us of a faith, which is essentially un-perishable, differently of gold, which is essentially perishable:

1 Peter 1:7

That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:

Then, when the Lord says: "he that endureth to the end shall be saved" (Matthew 10:22; 24:13), he is speaking not of a Dan Corner's "condition for" but of a biblical "resultant fact", the resultant fact resulting from the intrinsically un-perishable faith of the true believer as Peter has said. We can conciliate the Scripture, Dan cannot. The Lord says us also:

Luke 21:17-19

17 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name’s sake.

18 But there shall not an hair of your head perish.

19 In your patience possess ye your souls.

He says "But there shall not {double emphatic negation} an hair of your head perish", it is a statement of a fact which will occur without failing, the Lord uses the Greek double emphatic negation "ou mh", meaning "in no way". The commandment "In your patience possess ye your souls" is then of secured accomplishment because "there shall not {that is, "in no way"} an hair of your head perish". So, the Christian has been translated into the kingdom of His dear Son, his present faith is un-perishable, Dan speaks of a faith which need to be maintained to endure to the end, the Word of God speaks us of a faith which is un-perishable. Whom will you believe?

The Dan’s blindness on the verses he himself is quoting:

Then, Dan Corner follows saying: "In other words, though he now possesses eternal life, he is also on the road that leads to [eternal] life (Mt. 7:14 cf. Mt. 25:46) with the possibility of {then follow a list of bad works, many of them referred to unbelievers, that supposedly can cause the loss of eternal life}"; here is a citation of Scripture he uses not seeing it is plainly contrary to his position, in Mathew 7:13-14 the Lord says that those not finding the strait gate are the lost, not those who have found the strait gate:

Mathew 7: 13, 14

13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

But Dan Corner is confounded and only cause to confuse us speaking as if a true believer having found the strait gate may become lost.

Can you see it? Can you see how Dan Corner is wrong? Note carefully how the Lord says that those NOT FINDING the strait gate are the lost, NOT THOSE WHO HAVE FOUND the strait gate; while Dan Corner is speaking us of how those who have found the strait gate, who are in the road leading to eternal life, may become lost. Whom will you believe? Dan Corner or the Lord? Dan quotes also Mt. 25:46: "And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal." Do you believe someone of the few the Lord make saved for finding the strait gate will be between those into everlasting punishment? Dan does. The Lord DOESN’T. The Lord contrasts two opposite things, the finally lost and the finally saved, the finally lost as not finding the strait gate, the finally saved as finding the strait gate.

It is now opportune also notice that finding the strait gate is not the final salvation but it is the initial salvation. The strait gate is the entrance to the road leading to eternal life (eternal life is here the final salvation); because the Lord associates and unites the gate to the road; moreover perhaps the road is a constituent part of the gate because the Greek word “pulee” for gate is the word used for “pass” as the pass through mountains; the objective thing is the Lord mentions two feminine Greek words “gate” and “road” and finally, without denoting which of them He is referring to, He says that “few there be that find it”, where the “it” (in Greek) is a feminine pronoun referring to the gate or the road or both (the distinction is unimportant because the gate implies the road). And here is the remarkable thing, the Lord makes finally saved (final salvation) all entering the strait gate (initial salvation), and He makes finally lost those not finding the strait gate; or in other words, THE LORD MAKES INITIAL SALVATION NECESSARY AND SUFFICIENT TO ATTAIN FINAL SALVATION!!!! Do you see it? Dan Corner doesn’t. Please, again note the Lord is saying us those NOT FINDING the strait gate (initial salvation) are the lost, NOT THOSE WHO HAVE FOUND the strait gate (initial salvation); while Dan Corner is speaking us of how those few in the road having finding the strait gate (initial salvation) may become lost. Whom will you believe? Dan Corner or the Lord?

We have now two passages teaching us that final salvation is assured by initial salvation, we increase here our presentation of biblical initial salvation:

Initial Salvation, according to Colossians 1:12-13, simply refers to entering the kingdom of God, which occurs really in a past time of the life of the true believer, the first time he has believed; thus the language of the Apostle speaks as if we the true believers are now into the kingdom, thus assuring us with his strong language we shall enter the final phase of the kingdom at last. That is the same as presented by the Lord in Mathew 7: 13, 14, initial salvation is to find the strait gate, and it is presented by the Lord as necessary and sufficient to attain final salvation.

Then, not having perceived the words of the Lord, who make finally saved (final salvation) all entering the strait gate (initial salvation), Dan Corner follow directly contradicting the Lord by saying "with the possibility of wandering off ... etc.", and so he is saying us the true believer can lose his salvation, because he add "then Dear reader, even if you are a true Christian this horrible thing could happen to you also, unless you do certain things to prevent it, according to Scripture!”; clearly the horrible thing Dan is threatening us with is his imaginary idea of a true believer having found the strait gate but that may losse his salvation. But the Lord said us a contrast between two opposite things, the finally lost and the finally saved, the finaly lost as not finding the strait gate, the finally saved as finding the strait gate and in the road to eternal life. I wonder, if Dan found a gate which gave him not assurance of final salvation, which gate is it? It is not the strait gate the Lord spoke us!! Is Dan in the road leading to eternal life?

So, when Dan Corner quotes verses he doesn’t see the implications of some of these verses. Another example: Romans 6:22, quoted when he said that at INITIAL SALVATION "Such a person is also set free from the slavery of sin", which is a verse teaching that FINAL SALVATION IS SECURED BY INITIAL SALVATION ONLY:

Romans 6:22

But now being made free from sin {aorist tense, a closed and terminated past act}, and become servants to God {aorist tense, a closed and terminated past act}, ye have {present tense, indicative mood, present and uninterrupted possession} your fruit unto holiness, and the end {final salvation} everlasting life {The complete expression is literally, according the Greek: “ye have the fruit of you unto holiness and [ye have] the end [which is] everlasting life”}.

We have here two closed and terminated past acts, being made free from sin and become servants to God, and the results of those past completed acts are therefore not dependent nor conditioned on another future thing; because those are said only to depend on those past completed acts; those results from those past acts are the fruit unto holiness and the end, which is everlasting life, being the latter the FINAL SALVATION. Then, we have here that the FINAL SALVATION IS ONLY DEPENDENT ON TWO PAST ACTS OF INITIAL SALVATION, NOT UPON FUTURE CONDITIONS THROUGHOUT THE LIFE OF THE BELIEVER.

Again we can increase our presentation of initial salvation:

John 8:32-36 is also quoted when Dan said that at INITIAL SALVATION "Such a person is also set free from the slavery of sin"; curiously enough, Dan didn’t note the powerful implications of these verses, which teach that once a person became a son of God, he remains always a son of God, and that being a son of God is equated to be free from the slavery of sin. Here is the passage; I have highlighted the words speaking of the “ALWAYS”:

John 8:32-36

32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

33 They answered him, We be Abraham’s seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how sayest thou, Ye shall be made free?

34 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.

35 And the servant abideth not in the house for ever: but the Son abideth ever.

36 If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

On this passage there are a good commentary from Jamieson-Fausset-Brown:

35. And the servant abideth not in the house for ever, but the Son abideth ever—that is, "And if your connection with the family of God be that of BOND-SERVANTS, ye have no natural tie to the house; your tie is essentially uncertain and precarious. But the SON’S relationship to the FATHER is a natural and essential one; it is an indefeasible tie; His abode in it is perpetual and of right: That is My relationship, My tie: If, then, ye would have your connection with God’s family made real, rightful, permanent, ye must by the Son be manumitted and adopted as sons and daughters of the Lord Almighty." In this sublime statement there is no doubt a subordinate allusion to Ge 21:10, "Cast out this bondwoman and her son, for the son of this bond-woman shall not be heir with my son, with Isaac." (Compare Ga 4:22-30).

Now a good commentary from Barnes:

Verse 35. The servant abideth not, &c. The servant does not, of course, remain for ever, or till his death, with his master. If he is disobedient and wicked, the master sells him or turns him away. He is not the heir, and may at any time be expelled from the house of his master. But a son is the heir. He cannot be in this manner cast off or sold. He is privileged with the right of remaining in the family. This takes place in common life. So said the Saviour to the Jews: "You, if you are disobedient and rebellious, may at any time be rejected from being the people of God, and be deprived of your peculiar privileges as a nation. You are in the condition of servants, and unless you are made free by the gospel, and become entitled to the privilege of the sons of God, you will be cast off like an unfaithful slave." Comp. He 3:5,6.

Abideth not. Remains not, or has not the legal right to remain. He may at any time be rejected or sold.

In the house. In the family of his master.

For ever. During the whole time of his life.

The Son. The heir. He remains, and cannot be sold or cast off.

Ever. Continually. Till the day of his death. This is the privilege of a son, to inherit and dispose of the property.

Now a good commentary from The Four Fold Gospel:

Joh 8:35

And the bondservant abideth not in the house for ever: the son abideth for ever. For light on this passage read Ga 4:19-21. Slaves have no permanent relationship to a house, and may be changed at will. God was about to dismiss the Jews as unfaithful slaves (Lu 20:16-19). Sons, on the contrary, have a permanent relationship to the house, and if a son take one into fraternal adoption, he communicates to such a one his own perpetuity (Ro 8:2).

THE TRUTH ABOUT DAN CORNER’S

MISUSED VERSES

Now, here are the passages Dan twist to frighten the true believers saying "then Dear reader, even if you are a true Christian this horrible thing could happen to you also, unless you do certain things to prevent it, according to Scripture!", 1 Tim. 6:10,21; 2 Tim. 2:18; 2 Pet. 2:15; Jn. 6:66; 1 Tim. 5:15; Lk. 8:13; Mt. 11:6; 26:31; Mt. 24:10; 2 Thess. 2:3; 1 Tim. 4:1; 2 Tim. 4:4, 2 Peter 3:9. We shall see the true interpretations of these passages and others Dan twist contradicting Paul, Lord's Apostle, and the Lord Himself, there will be also some few verses misused by other different people, not necessarily Dan Corner. Other misused passages will be treated all along this treatise, not only in this part of the treatise

The 1 Timothy 6:10 case:

Dan have not problem to quote this verse 1 Timothy 6:10 as if it were a proof for his false doctrine, saying also:

112. Did Paul personally know of some Christians who were eager for money and consequently wandered from the Christian faith (1 Tim. 6:10)? ___Yes ___No

(www.evangelicaloutreach.org\question.htm, Questions, Chapter 20 of the book, The Believer's Conditional Security, by Dan Corner )

Don’t be deceived! According to Scripture, it is possible to: ……… wander away from the faith (1 Tim. 6:10,21)

(www.evangelicaloutreach.org\tragedies.htm, Possible Spiritual Tragedies Between

Initial and Final Salvation)

Now we shall see the truth:

1 Timothy 6:10

For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows. {erred: or, been seduced}

This passage don’t affirm the faith of a true Christian can perish, because if so, it would be a contradiction of the following direct statement that the faith of a Christian is un-perishable:

1 Peter 1:7

That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ

The "they have erred from the faith" from 1 Timothy 6:10 need to be interpreted without contradicting the direct statement of 1 Peter 1:7; Dan Corner does not that; he is incapable of present an interpretation without contradicting the direct statement of 1 Peter 1:7. The "they have erred from the faith" is a very general statement which cannot be rendered as if it is speaking of a faith which perished; and to render it so would be contrary to 1 Peter 1:7. Is by 1 Timothy 6:9 we know it may be the case of a not converted one who doesn’t have salvation and not attains true faith by the seduction of money (the original Greek says literally "they has been seduced away from before the faith"; the Greek word used here for "they has been seduced" is the same as "to seduce" in Mark 13:22:

Mark 13:22

For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect.

Where "to seduce" can be translated by his synonym "to deceive". Yea, it may be the case of a not converted one as in the following case:

Mark 4.18-19

18 And these are they which are sown among thorns; such as hear the word,

19 And the cares of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, and the lusts of other things entering in, choke the word, and it becometh unfruitful.

By the way, without referring the case of 1 Timothy 6:10, there are the possibility of a true converted one which fails temporarily and is confounded or offended temporarily in his faith but even so his faith doesn’t perish:

Matthew 26:31-35

31 Then saith Jesus unto them, All ye shall be offended because of me this night: for it is written, I will smite the shepherd, and the sheep of the flock shall be scattered abroad.

32 But after I am risen again, I will go before you into Galilee.

33 Peter answered and said unto him, Though all men shall be offended because of thee, yet will I never be offended.

34 Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, That this night, before the cock crow, thou shalt deny me thrice.

35 Peter said unto him, Though I should die with thee, yet will I not deny thee. Likewise also said all the disciples.

Luke 22: 31-32

31 And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat:

32 But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and when thou art converted, strengthen thy brethren.

Yea, a true believer with an un-perishable faith may be offended and sifted temporarily, but as his faith is un-perishable, the Lord will sustain it un-perishable, the faith doesn’t fail never; "But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not" is a statement saying that the Lord is responsible that the true faith doesn’t fail (the Greek word for "fail" is a verb in present tense so is an uninterrupted faith here spoken of). Suppose you are a true believer in the Lord, but suppose you err and fail, even so your un-perishable faith doesn’t fail, IS UN-PERISHABLE ACCORDING TO 1 PETER 1:7!!! Dan may present you his typical "examples", but the Bible present us its proper examples of temporarily failing true believers whit un-failing faith. Whom will you believe, Dan or the Bible? There are many mentions of failing in the Bible, some for unbelievers, some for true believers, some for both (and some are difficult to say for whom); but Dan Corner is very hurry to ignore 1 Peter 1:7, Matthew 26:31-35, Luke 22: 31-32, and the true biblical concept of decisive initial salvation, and to apply nearly all cases of failing to true believers, then conveniently for his false doctrine he could put true believers under a perdition proper to unbelievers. But he is deflecting us again and again, he is concealing from us that the true believer has un-perishable faith, as 1 Peter 1:7 says and ignoring the true biblical concept of decisive initial salvation.

The same confusing pattern Dan Corner applied to 1 Timothy 6:10 will be applied again an again. The case of 1 Timothy 6:21 is better treated at the following section because it contains a different Greek word than the 1 Timothy 6:10 verse, and it is not convenient to be guided by the translations of Dan Corner who frequently uses a same translation for different words robbing us the nuances of these words, even more, he uses bad translations not mirroring the true meaning of the Greek.

The 2 Timothy 2:18, 1 Timothy 1:3-6 and 1 Timothy 6:20-21 case:

Dan has not problem to quote this verses as if they are proofs for his false doctrine, saying:

Don’t be deceived! According to Scripture, it is possible to: ……… wander away from the faith (1 Tim. 6:10,21)

(www.evangelicaloutreach.org\tragedies.htm, Possible Spiritual Tragedies Between

Initial and Final Salvation)

Don’t be deceived! According to Scripture, it is possible to: … wander away from a pure heart, a good conscience and a sincere faith and turn to meaningless talk (1 Tim. 1:5,6)

(www.evangelicaloutreach.org\tragedies.htm, Possible Spiritual Tragedies Between Initial and Final Salvation)

Now we shall see the truth:

2 Timothy 2:18

Who concerning the truth have erred {a same Greek word for “erred"}

, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.

Again, this passage don’t affirm the faith of a true Christian can perish, because if so, it would be a contradiction of the following direct statement that the faith of a Christian is un-perishable:

1 Peter 1:7

That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ

The "overthrow the faith of some" from 2 Timothy 2:18 need to be interpreted without contradicting the direct statement of 1 Peter 1:7; Dan Corner does not that; again he is incapable of present an interpretation without contradicting the Bible. The "overthrow the faith of some" is a very general statement which can not be rendered as if it is speaking of a true faith which perished; and to render so would be contrary to 1 Peter 1:7. A true believer may to have his true and un-perishable faith temporarily overthrown as Peter during his failing at the negation episode; let us return to the case of Peter and the rest of the disciples:

Matthew 26:31

Then saith Jesus unto them, All ye shall be offended because of me this night: for it is written, I will smite the shepherd, and the sheep of the flock shall be scattered abroad.

Matthew 26:34

Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, That this night, before the cock crow, thou shalt deny me thrice.

Luke 22: 31

And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat:

We can see the disciples were offended and sifted, and even we can say that his faith was shacked to the fundaments, and as they were offended we can say that his faith was overthrown (as in 2 Timothy 2:18); but as his faith is un-perishable, the Lord sustained it un-perishable, the faith doesn’t fail never; "But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not" is a statement saying the Lord is responsible that the true faith doesn’t fail (the Greek word for "fail" is a verb in present tense). The Greek word for "overthrow" in 2 Timothy 2:18 is the same word used in Titus 1:11 and translated "to subvert", which is the translation used in the Spanish version of Reina-Valera 1909 at 2 Timothy 2:18, and can be rendered "to upset", "to disrupt", "to disturb"; there are no doubt the disciples were very disturbed and subverted the sad night Peter denied the Lord; but no one of them lost his faith. Now, only we need to point out the disciples have not IN them the Holy Ghost, but the Holy Ghost was WITH them at this point in his lives before the Spirit descent in them at Pentecost:

John 14:16-17

16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you { Greek: between you} for ever;

17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you {Greek: at your side} , and shall be in you {Greek: in you}.

So the Peter and disciples case is exceptional because they were believers approaching the time of the Holy Ghost indwelling, a thing never seen before in the Old Testament times; so the Arminians, when putting Old Testament examples of “believers that lost the Spirit, or the faith, or the salvation”, are showing their sad ignorance of the difference between a New Testament believer and an Old Testament believer. For the New Testament believer only remains the redemption of his body; but for the Old Testament believers it was remaining the redemption of their souls and of their bodies; it is a great difference that the Corners of the world ignore, as they ignore many things. We hope with faith the redemption of our body (Romans 8:23) which will be the complement of the salvation of the soul (the believers which are asleep are hoping the redemption of their bodies too as a final aspect of salvation for their saved souls), but the Old Testament believers hoped with faith the redemption of their soul and body, the souls of the dead believers of the Old Testament were in a subterranean place contiguous to the hell (Luke 16:19-30), they were well, but they were not still in heaven, and the paradise was below, because the way to the holiest of all was still not open (Hebrews 9:8); only when the Lord was dead and the precious blood of the New Covenant was spilt and He was resurrected as our priest that way was open (Hebrews 10:16-20) and the believers at the paradise were translated to the heaven (The paradise then below: Luke 23:43; the paradise now in the third heaven 2 Corinthians 12:2-4).

As for the “Who concerning the truth have erred” of 2 Timothy 2:18, it can be easily applied to any one that is teaching false doctrine, be it a true believer or not, and depending on the truth that it is being contradicted we can suspect the true state of the contradictor. For example, there are many true believers contradicting the postribulational truth that the Church will be taken to Christ AFTER the Great tribulation, pretribulationist are erring concerning the truth, but that is not a very serious erring. But there are the Dan Corners saying that the salvation of the believers is conditional and not finally secured, making so the salvation to depend on works, then very sadly, the Dan Corners are most probably unbelievers because they don’t believe in the true gospel but they believe a false gospel and then they are most probably lost, concerning the truth they have erred seriously. In the 2 Timothy 2:18 case we probably have a serius erring undermining greatly the doctrine of the believers resurrection at the second coming of Christ (perhaps a sort of Preterist). The same criterion applied to 2 Timothy 2:18 can be applied to the following verses:

1 Timothy 1:3-6

3 As I besought thee to abide still at Ephesus, when I went into Macedonia, that thou mightest charge some that they teach no other doctrine,

4 Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do.

5 Now the end of the commandment is charity out of a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned:

6 From which some having swerved {the same Greek word for “erred"}

1 Timothy 6:20-21

20 O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called:

21 Which some professing have erred {the same Greek word for “erred”} concerning the faith. Grace be with thee. Amen.

So are void of force the following statements of Dan Corner:

{About 1 Timothy 1:3-6:}

After all of that, Paul sadly refers to some, whom he knew, that wandered away from the same kind of pure heart and a good conscience and a sincere faith that he had, which testifies beyond all doubt to the fact that they were previously saved.

(www.evangelicaloutreach.org\1timothy.htm, Eight Stirring Passages From 1 Timothy, Dan Corner)

{About 1 Timothy 6:20-21 :}

Timothy, guard what has been entrusted to your care. Turn away from godless chatter and the opposing ideas of what is falsely called knowledge, which some have professed and in so doing have wandered from the faith. Grace be with you. (1 Tim 6:20, 21)

Finally, another warning of life or death magnitude is given about godless talk and teachings that are contradictory to Scripture, which could lead to the spiritual downfall of even Timothy himself

(www.evangelicaloutreach.org\1timothy.htm, Eight Stirring Passages From 1 Timothy, Dan Corner)

The Dan Corner’s “wandered … ” is a very bad translation for the Greek word for “erred”: astocheo as-tokh-eh’-o from a compound of “a” (as a negative particle) and stoichos (an aim); miss the aim. Then is a false conclusion that some having missing the aim of a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned were then true believers; the conversely is the better, those which have not “a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned” they are who may not to reach them or may to miss that aim, so as an archer can miss his target not reaching it. Also is a false conclusion that some having erred concerning “the faith” were true believers; the conversely is the better, some one not having “the faith”, such one may to miss it, so as an archer can miss his target not reaching it. And why Timothy did need to avoid the profane babblings? Obviously because that can upset his faith, but not because that can eradicate absolutely his un-perishable faith (1 Peter 1:7). Nevertheless Dan Corner prefers the bad way selecting a reason that contradicts the plain Scripture of 1 Peter 1.7.

The 2 Peter 2:15 case:

2 Peter 2:15

Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Bosor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness

We can affirm that Peter is speaking here of UNBELIEVERS, NOT OF BELIEVERS WHO HAVE LOST HIS SALVATION. Dan has resulted here attempting to make us believe Peter is speaking of true believers. That is not the case. If we continue reading the passage we shall discover those men were not believers. Let us put the entire passage, then I shall highlight the parts showing us that those men were not believers:

2 Peter 2:15-22

15 Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Bosor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;

16 But was rebuked for his iniquity: the dumb ass speaking with man’s voice forbad the madness of the prophet.

17 These are wells without water, clouds that are carried with a tempest; to whom the mist of darkness is reserved for ever.

18 For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error. {clean: or, for a little, or, a while, as some read}

19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.

20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.

21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.

22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

You see it, that those men were not sheep of the Lord; they are called dogs and sows. They are not called sheep that turned to be dogs and sows; they are called dogs that turned to his own vomit again, and sows that were washed to their wallowing in the mire. Then they were not true believers, because the Lord said us clearly that those remaining unbelievers are not of His sheep; then the believers are His sheep:

John 10:26

But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.

And Dan would make us to err by making us believe Peter is here speaking of true believers! Again Dan Corner is very hurry to ignore 1 Peter 1:7, Matthew 26:31-35, Luke 22: 31-32, and the biblical concept of initial salvation securing final salvation, and to apply nearly all cases of failing of unbelievers to true believers, so conveniently for his false conclusion he could put true believers under a perdition proper to unbelievers. It is a typical pattern of Dan corner and his followers. A tricky pattern we now know very well!!

I have found a case of a Dan Corner adherent following this same pattern but applying it to "experience". The guy picked up wordly guys, then will make them appear as true believers who had lost their salvation; it is necessary for many to say "experience" doesn’t prove a doctrine; there are MANY, MANY unregenerate unbelievers professing faith but without salvation at all; we can experience the saying of their mouth, his profession and temporary change, but latter we cannot experience from him the evidence of a true conversion. But the Dan Corner's guys see those poor unbelievers, then experience the saying of their mouths and their temporary superficial change, then come to us saying that they have "experienced" a true believer, then they later experience the evidence of the state of perdition of those poor professing but unbelievers, then come to us saying that they have "experienced" those guys lost their salvation. It is the same tricky pattern Dan Corner showed for the 2 Peter 2:15 case, but applied to "experience".

From www.truthkeepers.com/osas.htm (taken at June 30, 2004), an article by C. H. Fisher, I have been reading that article and there are many unclear things, again that tricky pattern. Fisher presents his proper "experience" as a believer who lost his salvation:

First I want to tell you my personal experience of how an individual can actually walk completely away from God and still believe they are saved and on their way to heaven. Not only did I leave the church, I abandoned God and went out into deep sin, yet all the time I thought I was still heaven bound. While in a drug induced, drunken stupor, I would say the Lord's prayer every night before I went to sleep. I believed that saying the Lord's prayer covered my sins and I would be accepted into heaven if I died in my sleep. However, one day I realized that I was in fact headed for hell if I did not change my life. I go into more detail about my past and my salvation experience in my testimony {link to www.truthkeepers.com/testimon.htm}. When God saved me, I had a complete change inside and out. There was no doubt in my mind that if I had died before this change I would have went straight to hell.

But, OH SURPRISE!!!! While he said us "Not only did I leave the church, I abandoned God and went out into deep sin, yet all the time I thought I was still heaven bound", Having read his testimony I have found it:

I didn't really know much about the devil at that time or his various religions. Although I was raised in a Baptist church and said the Lord's Prayer every night I could think of it, I didn't know anything about God either.

If he didn't know anything about God, how in the world he can present himself as a Once Saved that his salvation? How in the world? Answer: BY THE TRICKY PATTERN OF to apply nearly all cases of failing of unbelievers to true believers, so conveniently for his confusing view he could put true believers under a perdition proper to unbelievers. It is a typical pattern of Dan corner and his followers. A tricky pattern we now know very well!!

And here an important and opportune issue rises, so as a true believer can fail (Peter at the negation episode) so an unbeliever can "un-fail" (the men of 2 Peter 2:15). Those men, Peter say us, "have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ", and even more, they "have known the way of righteousness" and they have received "the holy commandment delivered unto them". But those men NEVER WERE SAVED, Peter calls them dogs and sows returning to their proper filthiness. It is important to explain how people apparently Christian become apostate. The apostasy is a phenomenon proper of unbelievers; it is not proper of believers. Remember, true believers have experienced the initial salvation, which assures them final salvation.

And that the true believers are never to be apostates became evident also because his faith is un-perishable (1 Peter 1:7).

So the apostasy is a phenomenon of unbelievers returning to their old lives after having experienced temporarily the benign influence of the gospel and the Holy Ghost, but having experienced neither true faith nor initial salvation nor regeneration, apostasy is not proper of believers.

But Dan has not problem to quote this verse 2 Peter 2:15 as if it were a proof for his false doctrine, saying:

Not only did Peter know the believer’s security was conditional, but he boldly and unequivocally taught that a true Christian can leave the straight way. Some, however, refuse to accept this Scriptural fact and in opposition to it parrot: They were never really saved to begin with. To live in the straight way carries the same benefit as having escaped the corruption of the world by knowing our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. But such a person, who departs from the straight way, will then become entangled and overcome by sin’s corruption again! It is about such former Christians, who turn their backs on the sacred command that Peter stated:

It would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than to have known it and then to turn their backs on the sacred command that was passed on to them.

(www.evangelicaloutreach.org\sin.htm, The Slavery, Bondage and Controlling Power of Sin, Dan Corner)

It is interesting how Dan points the following, “But such a person, who departs from the straight way, will then become entangled and overcome by sin’s corruption again!” Yes, “again!” but Dan have failed to notice (or perhaps he doesn’t want to notice) they are not called sheep that turned to be dogs and sows; they are called dogs that turned to his own vomit again! and sows that were washed to their wallowing in the mire. Then they were not true believers, because the Lord said us clearly that those remaining unbelievers are not of His sheep; then the believers are his sheep:

John 10:26

But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.

So we can see we are not “parroting” they were not saved to begin with; it is Peter himself who says it! By the way, it is a little strange and comic to imagine Peter as a Dan Corner teacher of conditional security, all I heard of Dan is that a true believer can lose his faith, while Peter the Apostle said that faith is un-perishable (1 Peter 1:7). Dan and Peter were by different ways!

Many false teachers unbelievers may be false teachers by having forsaken the right way (2 Peter 2:15), but those are not the same words nor the same thing that a true believer departing from the narrow way, which is an idea directly contradicting the Lord Himself. We have seen this error of Dan previously.

Mathew 7: 13, 14

13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

The Lord contrasts two opposite things, the finally lost and the finally saved, the finally lost as not finding the strait gate and the narrow way, the finally saved as finding the strait gate and the narrow way. There are not such things as walkers of the narrow way reported as lost; because the walkers of the narrow way are presented by the Lord as finally saved in opposition to the finally lost of the broad road.

The John 6:66 and Matthew 10:22 and 24:13 case:

Dan Corner using this verses:

Many get saved, but afterwards fall away (Lk. 8:13; Jn. 6:66; 1 Tim. 1:19; etc.).

(www.evangelicaloutreach.org\index.html, True Salvation)

Who will be thrown into this ETERNAL FIRE? … Those who don't … endure to the end (Mt. 10:22 cf. Jn. 6:66)

(www.evangelicaloutreach.org\salvtion.htm, The Lake of Fire)

Furthermore, we see elsewhere that some of the Lord's very own followed him no more, Jn. 6:66.

(www.evangelicaloutreach.org\porno2.htm, Pornography, Lust and Salvation)

This was not true for King Saul, King Solomon, the Apostle Judas Iscariot, the unnamed disciples of Jn. 6:66, and certainly many others throughout the centuries!

(www.evangelicaloutreach.org\faq.htm, Frequently Asked Questions About Eternal Security, Excerpt from Chapter 16 of the book, The Believer's Conditional Security, by Dan Corner)

Don’t be deceived! According to Scripture, it is possible to: … turn back and no longer follow Jesus (Jn. 6:66)

(www.evangelicaloutreach.org\tragedies.htm, Possible Spiritual Tragedies Between

Initial and Final Salvation)

Without a doubt, Saul, Solomon and the unnamed disciples of Jn. 6:66 were all saved then later turned from God and never came back!

(www.evangelicaloutreach.org\notsaved.htm, "He Was Never Really Saved To Begin With!" (Or Was He After All?), Dan Corner)

Now we shall see the truth:

John 6:66

From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.

It is nothing new, it is the same pattern again and again; Dan has make us to err by making us believe the Lord is here speaking of true believers who went back. That is not the case. If we read the entire passage we shall discover those men going back were not believers. Let us put the entire passage, then I shall highlight the verse which shows us that those men going back were not believers; as an established contrast, I shall highlight also the verse which shows us that those men remaining whit Christ were true believers, whit the pointed exception of Judas:

John 6:60-71

60 Many therefore of his disciples, when they had heard this, said, This is an hard saying; who can hear it?

61 When Jesus knew in himself that his disciples murmured at it, he said unto them, Doth this offend you? {offend: or, scandalize, or, cause you to stumble}

62 What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?

63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

64 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.

65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.

66 From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.

67 Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away?

68 Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.

69 And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God.

70 Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil?

71 He spake of Judas Iscariot the son of Simon: for he it was that should betray him, being one of the twelve.

Let us think about this statement at v.64, "But there are some of you that believe not"; it is a statement directed to His disciples (v. 61); it is a statement of the Lord which has a subject, "some of you that believe not", unbelievers between His disciples; and a fact about such subject, about such unbelievers between His disciples, is that they were between the disciples. And if you think they were believers who ceased to be believers, you are mistaken, please read the verse; after that Lord's statement about the actual presence of unbelievers between His disciples, John give us a reason for such statement, that is: "For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him." That is the reason why Jesus maked such statement about the presence of unbelievers between His disciples, the reason was not that some believers ceased to be such; the reason was that FROM THE BEGINNING THEY WERE UNBELIEVERS, because the Lord "knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him." Moreover, the immediately following statement of Jesus (v. 65) is the reason why were such unbelievers between His disciples, the reason is that they have not yet come to Jesus: "And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father."

Now you can easily figure out whom were those going back, and walking no more with Him. Yea, they were unbelievers, like Judas. But as for the believers, those who have come unto Him, those given unto Him of His Father ALL THEY WERE SAVED; read for yourself:

John 17:6

I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.

John 17:9

I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.

John 17:12

While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.

John 18:9

That the saying might be fulfilled, which he spake, Of them which thou gavest me have I lost none.

“NONE” WAS WELL SAID “NONE”. Judas is not included between them which the Father had given Jesus; moreover, Judas was included in v.64 as one of the reasons wherefore Jesus said "But there are some of you that believe not"; and then, for Judas also is given the reason (v.65) why they (then Judas included) are unbelievers, the reason is they have not yet come to Jesus (then Judas included): "And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father." So, Judas was not given unto Christ of His Father according to v.64 and v. 65. So, dear reader, when someone, Arminian, Methodist-Wesleyan, Assembly of God man or similar, would come to you saying that Judas was a true believer who lost his salvation, don’t believe him.

But as for the believers, those who have come unto Him, those who were given unto Him of His Father ALL THEY WERE SAVED. Then Dan Corner and his Arminian fellows are WRONG presenting John 6:66 as a proof of believers that lost their salvation.

As for Matthew 10:22; 24:13:

Matthew 10:22

And ye shall be hated of all men for my name’s sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.

Matthew 24:13

But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

The Lord says: "he that endureth to the end shall be saved", but he is speaking not of a Dan Corner's "condition for" but of a biblical "resultant fact", the resultant fact resulting from the intrinsically un-perishable faith of the true believer Peter has said of. We can conciliate the Scripture, Dan cannot. The Lord says us too:

Luke 21:17-19

17 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name’s sake.

18 But there shall not an hair of your head perish.

19 In your patience possess ye your souls.

He says "But there shall not {double emphatic negation} an hair of your head perish", it is a statement of